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Buyers Guide for VE Commodore and HSV
Buyers Guide for VE Commodore and HSV
This articles aims to inform you of the variations between the VE models from 2006-2013.
Engines
The earliest VE range in the Commodores used the L98 engine which is a 6L block the same as the LS2 used in the VZ HSV 297 but using the newer rectangular port heads which are called L92. The USA GM vehicles didn't use this engine combination. The HSV in the early VE used the LS2 engine and they are the 307 HSVs, these use the LS2 block and the older style heads using the best design ever released in a factory head casting 243 that had cathedral ports. The 243 heads do not flow as good as the L92 head so if these engines had the same camshaft the engine with the L92 would make more power. The 307 HSV had a better camshaft standard and that gave them a small power advantage although not as much as the 307 versus 270 badging suggested.
The next evolution of the HSV engine was to change to the LS3 which has a slightly bigger bore and is using LS3 heads which are pretty much the same as L92 heads but use lighter valves. This engine has been retained all the way to do the current VF in the HSV. Only the VF GTS has a different engine in the LSA.
The Holden Commodores with automatic gearboxes in around 2009 changed to the L76. This engine had hardware inside that made it so that the engine could run on 4 cylinders to save fuel. The manuals at that stage kept the L98. Other than that the L76 is the same as the L98.
Later in the Series II VE all of the Holden Commodores got the L77 engine which has the 4 cylinder de-actvation hardware even in the Manual gearbox models. The AFM technology is only active in the cars with automatic gearboxes. The L77 tended to perform better than the L76 probably due to a better camshaft. The VF Holdens have stayed with the L77 engine until the series II where they changed to LS3 6.2L.
Clutches
The early VE Commodores and HSV models had a clutch that was troublesome with slave cylinder related issues. The common symptom is that when the car is given repeated high load the clutch pedal will stay down. If the user persists or if the engine is modded to make more power than standard the clutch will slip at high rpm and this will quickly wear out the clutch. There are many VEs with these clutches driving around with early stages of these problems without showing any obvious symptomsbut give them more power and it will become obvious. The later model VEs had the clutch changed to the LS& Corvette clutch and an improved slave. Many early VEs with the problem clutch system had them replaced with the LS7 clutch under warranty.
The new LS7 clutch rarely presents any problems and even cars with superchargers and camshaft upgrades making over 400 rwkw seem to have few troubles.
Watch this video with Jono of Oztrack talking clutches.
Auto Gearboxes
The automatic gearbox in the VE V8 is the 6L80e but its behaviours and problems have changed over the time. The cars in the early models didnt blip on downshift when performed manually. These cars are the ones with the sport mode and traction control mode as buttons i front of the stick. The cars with the different arrangement which puts the car in sports mode when the stick is to the left all have blip on downshift active.
The earliest VE V8s all have an issue on cold start with the box slipping on the 2-3 shift the first time through the gears. This is normal for that model so take care, the fix is reported to be with mechanical upgrades that were done to later models.
The gearboxes seem to have become nicer as the model has progressed with the series II performing much nicer than the early VEs. These boxes can misbehave if under filled with fluid or if during routine maintenance incorrect fluid has been used.
Upgrading Info
If you are planning on performance modifications. The VE models all respond very well from exhaust system especially headers. The VE Commodores have very basic engine pipes and restrictive catalytic converters that do hold them back in power. The HSV models have headers but they are only a little better in performance overall than the Commodore front system. Even HSV often gain over 25 engine kw from a full exhaust system on top of an engine that has already been tuned with a good cold air intake. Often even the HSV cam gain over 60 engine kw from exhaust mods, cold air intake and tune.
The standard airboxes are all similarly restrictive these engines cry out for more cold air.
Cam upgrades for the L98, LS2 and LS3 engines are best done while at the same time changing to newer lifters, the AFM engined cars (L77/L76) also need a new valley plate and this add to the cost by about $250. Once they have the cam upgrade the cars with all the engine with L92 or LS3 heads end up making similar power. Some LS2 owners choose either to use LS3 heads as an upgrade which involved the use of a different intake manifold as well or they use good CNC ported LS2 heads instead (this is our preferred choice for LS2 307 owners)
Our Recommendation Summary
- Go for as new as possible and if budget permits it buy a HSV LS3 E3.
- The series II Commodores have the L77 engine , better clutch and bigger fuel pump fitted and can run on e85 fuel.
- The early model VE HSV 307 are a good deal just beware of the extra expense from the likely need to upgrade the clutch and slave this is over $2100
- The cheapest bargains are the oldest VE Commodores and you are getting a lot of car for the money. VEs grip much better than VZ and are much more stable on the road making them much better cruisers. The issue is either the clutch or the gearbox so test drive the car and assess it best you can. An auto gearbox rebuild can cost $4000 plus.
Other Gremlins
Other gremlins to be aware of are:
- Cam bearings being warn badly would require a full engine rebuild which is at least $8000. Sometimes cam bearings have been damaged by events when the oil pump has failed which can happen when the pressure relief valve sticks and the engine will have no oil pressure.If this happened for very long before the previous owner detected the problem then the damage could have been done.
- Rocker bearings can develop a sideways slop which can damage engine valve tops and even break the rocker or valve springs. These can be replaced with improved bearings which also give the rockers better vertical movement geometry.
- Lifters are the achilles heal of these engines and many of them have had failed lifters, if found early these can be replaced with a new oil pump for around $2500 but if noticed even a little bit late they chew out the cam lobe and this requires a new cam to be fitted with a good chance of associated bearing damage. Sometimes the lifters can break and do much more damage to the engines. Its a matter of how early the previous owner noticed the problem. A lifter with a problem will present a distinct solid knock or a repeated squeak. If the cam or main bearings are damaged this will make the engine need a full rebuild.
- It is essential that these engines have frequent oil changes to protect their bearing and lifters from premature wear and failure. So check the quality of the oil in the engine at the dipstick. These engines rarely ever use oil.
See our VE Performance Packages and Upgrades
Choosing a VE & VF Exhaust System?
Choosing VE or VF Exhaust Systems
One of the first things people often say to us about their new VE or VF Holden Commodore or HSV is that the exhaust sound is quiet and that their car doesnt sound like a V8.
Their question then is "What can i do to make it sound like a V8 should?" This article aims to answer that question and help you in choosing a VE or VF Exhaust system.
Good Sounding Exhaust
We have tried many different brands of exhaust over the past 6 years with the VE range and have found that many systems can make the car loud and attract attention. But few systems sound good. This is even more the case with VT-VZ models. The key aspect we don't like and we don't want to provide to our customers is a droning exhaust. That is the sound you get most often at around 1600rpm under load like when you are going up hill in top gear. Sometimes it can get so bad the sound will rattle items in the car and mostly will annoy the owner. The most common drone happens when people remove the rear mufflers in an attempt to get a louder and better sound. The usual result is they acheive loudness but get bucket loads of drone. To avoid drone the exhaust system needs to be selected carefully and you wont get a nice sounding no drone system cheaply. Wagons are the worst for drone and great care needs to be taken in the selection of exhaust for them in particular or you will be stuck with something that cost a fair bit of money that you dont like.
Stainless Steel Exhaust
We cannot count the number of times we have heard the statement, " we dont want to get a stainless system because I have been told they sound tinny". The truth is that in the old days stainless systems were thin and often did sound that way. But the exhaust systems we supply are made using much thicker stainless steel which gives the best sound of all. Mild steel systems tend to be lower pitched with a dull note to them that can easily be droney at low rpm high loads. The new stainless systems we use tend to be more "beatty" in their sound and the stainless steel gives a sharper edge to the note which is pleasant to the ear. This 'beatiness' is an effect of the exhaust where individual pulses are being heard. The psychological effect of the 'beatiness' is that as long as you can hear them the sound is pleasant and not droney , but lose those beats and we don't like it and label it as drone. Good headers that are working tend to make the exhaust sound even more beatty. This is because effective headers cause the exhaust pulses to constructively interfere and add up. This is evidence of exhaust scavenging from the headers actually working to help extract exhaust gas from the engines cylinders.
Bimodal Exhaust Systems
Some rear mufflers have valves on them to prevent exhaust gas flowing to all four tips at low loads when cruising, this can further eliminate any droney tones. Bimodal systems are standard on many of the HSV models in both the VE & VF. We have systems available that can use the factory bimodal wiring and function under the HSV dash EDI control.
Performance Improvement
On many cars even HSV LS3 we see a gain in power from a full exhaust system including headers, high flow metal cats and a performance catback of 20 rear wheel kw or more. This is on top of any gains found from a cold air intake or a tune. It is worth noting that you cannot just install a full exhaust system on any of the VE-VF models without a engine management computer calibration upgrade.
See our range of VE Performance Packages inc VE Exhaust systems
See our range of VF Performance Packages inc VF Exhaust systems
See our range of HSV Performance Packages inc HSV exhaust systems
